Reviewing, is Alinsky's plan working?

Discussion in 'The Dawgchat' started by JudgeLarryDawg, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. JudgeLarryDawg

    JudgeLarryDawg War Daddy
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    Beware the Useful Idiots
    submitted by Garret Geer
    Recall that Hillary did her college thesis on his writings and Obama writes about him in his books.

    Saul Alinsky died about 43 years ago, but his writings influenced those in political control of our nation today.

    Died: June 12, 1972, Carmel-by-the-Sea, CA

    Books: Rules for Radicals, Reveille for Radicals

    Anyone out there think that this stuff isn't happening today in the U.S.?

    All eight rules are currently in play.

    How to create a social state by Saul Alinsky:

    There are eight levels of control that must be obtained before you are able to create a social state. The first is the most important.

    1) Healthcare – Control healthcare and you control the people.

    2) Poverty – Increase the Poverty level as high as possible; poor people are easier to control and will not fight back if you are providing everything for them to live.

    3) Debt – Increase the debt to an unsustainable level. That way you are able to increase taxes, and this will produce more poverty.

    4) Gun Control– Remove the ability to defend themselves from the government. That way you are able to create a police state.

    5) Welfare – Take control of every aspect of their lives (Food, Housing, and Income).

    6) Education – Take control of what people read and listen to – take control of what children learn in school.

    7) Religion – Remove the belief in the God from the government and schools.

    8) Class Warfare – Divide the people into the wealthy and the poor. This will cause more discontent, and it will be easier to take (tax) the wealthy with the support of the poor.

    Does any of this sound like what is happening to the United States?

    Alinsky merely simplified Vladimir Lenin's original scheme for world conquest by communism, under Russian rule. Stalin described his converts as "Useful Idiots."

    The Useful Idiots have destroyed every nation in which they have seized power and control. It is presently happening at an alarming rate in the U.S.

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere."
     
  2. blackpug6

    blackpug6 Circle of Honor
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    well, Maduro in Venezuela got it Rockin!
     
  3. Tulsa A. Dawg

    Tulsa A. Dawg Loyal Member
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  4. deadduckdawg

    deadduckdawg Pillar of the Community
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  5. RumphSquatch

    RumphSquatch Diehard Member
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    Yep, and it wears the mask of virtue. And people are dumb enough to believe it.
     
  6. Bulldawg1971

    Bulldawg1971 Letterman
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    You are 100% correct. The Democratic Party lives by Alinsky’s teachings.
     
  7. jbpayne32

    jbpayne32 Silent Majority
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    Happy to debate all these points 1-by-1:

    1) Healthcare – Control healthcare and you control the people.
    - Provide healthcare and you protect your people. Medicare is a government program and has 80%+ approval ratings and I GUARANTEE everyone close to age is banking on this in retirement. Good luck finding private insurance at 65+.

    2) Poverty – Increase the Poverty level as high as possible; poor people are easier to control and will not fight back if you are providing everything for them to live.
    -This is so antitheum to any platform. If anyone wants to increase poverty, it’s Republicans by reducing the safety net for the poor.

    3) Debt – Increase the debt to an unsustainable level. That way you are able to increase taxes, and this will produce more poverty.
    -Trump’s tax cuts have increased debt spending despite the best economy in a decade...kind of backwards

    4) Gun Control– Remove the ability to defend themselves from the government. That way you are able to create a police state.
    -No one is saying take guns, but let’s keep them out of the hands of the crazy and unstable. How about you wait 2-3 days, so we can check you aren’t one of those?

    5) Welfare – Take control of every aspect of their lives (Food, Housing, and Income).
    -Tiny portion of the population and is a revolving door of people who need help. People are rarely on welfare for long, but it is important to keep people from being homeless.

    6) Education – Take control of what people read and listen to – take control of what children learn in school.
    -Government, local or otherwise has controlled school since the founding of this country

    7) Religion – Remove the belief in the God from the government and schools.
    -Happy to debate further

    8) Class Warfare – Divide the people into the wealthy and the poor. This will cause more discontent, and it will be easier to take (tax) the wealthy with the support of the poor.
    -This has occurred since before Christ...nothing new
     
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  8. atlanta cock#

    atlanta cock# Letterman
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  9. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    if not for dumb people....there'd be no Democrats. Think about the basics

    DemocRATS say they are for helping Poor people and the down trodden. Well if everyone were self sufficient , where would the DemocRAT party be? And these very people believe DemocRATS want to help them, the reality is every single Democrat position is based in keeping these idiots right where they are, they hate for people to be responsible and self supporting.


    So how else can anyone explain people that support democRATS.....They're stupid people
     
  10. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    Pal you are a true leftist,.No offense meant, but you're truly delusional

    1.Medicare, look up with it was predicted to cost by now, here's a hint, its a shit ton less than it actually is,

    2. Maybe the most delusional of your positions, you think giving people in poverty is the want to keep them from becoming poor??? No, its a way to KEEP THEM POOR AND DEPENDENT, and Every single democRAT policy is designed to to exactly that, without poor and dependent people there is no democRAT party. Its why they fight so hard to shoot down any proposal that would actually help them

    3. Tax cuts don't increase debt. You must be a millennial? Tax cuts have proven to raise Gov Revenues, SPENDING what you don't have increases debt

    4. How about we don't. What happens if a woman wants a gun because she has a crazy ex boyfriend who has threatened her? And that's not what DemocRATS want, they want to ban guns, period. Everything with them is incremental , look at abortion....what started as "oh only in unwanted children early in the process is now birthing them then killing them

    5. Welfare rolls were decreasing under Bush, Obama (aka POSotus) dramatically increase those rolls , DemocRATS want more and more people dependent on them, they need these programs so they can scare people into voting for them by claiming the Republicans are going to toss Grandma off a cliff.

    6. Not federal Gov, the education system has been overrun with Liberals, its why young people like you are so ignorant, you actually believe you got an education when in fact all you got was indoctrinated . Most young people are ignorant, look at how many want socialism, they don't even know what it is or its history, but they want it because some idiot like Crazy Bernie or this Moron AOC says its eutopia.......

    7. You'd lose

    8. You're right, its what charlatans and Socialist do. They can't defend their loony positions so they have to create a villain and tell morons that they're victims and that they will punish those who have made their lives miserable. In short, disgusting , evil people who want to keep people enslaved
     
  11. deadduckdawg

    deadduckdawg Pillar of the Community
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    Would you thus make being a democrat a disqualifier for gun ownership?
     
  12. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    He'd have too, almost all gun crime is committed by democrats and there is no doubt that to follow Nuts like Crazy Bernie, AOC, Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer, ETC you have to be mentally ill
     
  13. MooseHumperDawg

    MooseHumperDawg Letterman
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    Gun confiscation is being called for by dems at all levels of gov't all over the country. If you do not recognize that easily verifiable fact, your entire argument fails for want of credibility.
     
  14. jbpayne32

    jbpayne32 Silent Majority
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    I’m a gun owner
     
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  15. deadduckdawg

    deadduckdawg Pillar of the Community
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    Was really just kidding, and I have no problem with waiting periods. Crazy and unstable laws are on the books now, but sometimes are improperly enforced.

    Coincidentally, I am meeting a guy in 30 minutes to buy a .357 Magnum with no BOS. I only want the gun as a blank shooter to rattle a barking Beagle's brain. I do not want to hurt the dog, but if he keels over dead from a heart attack, all the better.

    I almost got him by pouring a quart of mountain lion urine, which I bought from Amazon, along his fence. He ran in a circle howling for 4 hours. The neighbor thought he was stroking out and took him to his parents' farm. I thought I was rid of him, but he came back after 2 weeks.
     
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  16. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    Stacy Abrams says she is too.........
     
  17. jbpayne32

    jbpayne32 Silent Majority
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    No offense, but I'm delusional? C'mon. We can disagree on positions, but if you just dismiss mine, then you aren't really open to a real discussion. I disagree with some of your positions, but I understand why you have them and where they come from as I lived in the South for 30+ years. And I agree with you in many ways. Just everyone on here stop with the name calling and wide ranging plaudits about what you believe all Democrats think, because there are a wide-range of views and no one agrees on everything.
     
  18. blackpug6

    blackpug6 Circle of Honor
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    sorry,
    but I tend to go full Dawg when I hear certain things.
    if this post does not affect you, please disregard this message.

    pug!
     
  19. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    Pal, Like I said, I didn't mean to insult you, but you have no basis in fact to post what you post, none whatsoever. I don't know how else to describe it. I can back up every single thing I posted with facts. You can't.

    Example, take number 2. Tell me exactly how Democrats try to alleviate poverty? and Republicans try and keep people in poverty?

    We've had 50 years + of the Great Society. Hows it worked out?....Not good unless you're a Democrat, then it worked as planned "we'll have those ni^^ers voting for Democrats for 50 years - LBJ

    Democrat policy is pure evil, because it takes away all hope and initiative....it creates generation after generation living in in that poverty you seem to think they're trying to eradicate.

    With those facts.....how else would you describe it?
     
  20. benchwarmerdawg

    benchwarmerdawg Letterman
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    Sir, if you are a dimorcrat and vote for dimocrats, you own their policies. You can say you don't believe in it all but when you vote for one, he sure as heck goes all out to destroy America when he/she/it gets to DC. So wake up. If you don't believe in their crap don't vote for their crap. Other wise, take your medicine and quit bitching about being called what you are.
     
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  21. Boom MFer Dawg

    Boom MFer Dawg Pillar of the Community
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    useful idiot :cool:
     
  22. jbpayne32

    jbpayne32 Silent Majority
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    Seriously? You've never cited anything, but just make these broad-based claims and call me a moron. Let's take the above. Just because you say something, doesn't make it a FACT. Give me some research that supports Democrat policies are evil? Show me a study that says said policies take away hope and initiative? How can we have generation after generation living in poverty when it has declined since the 60s? You have no facts to support your OPINIONS...
     
  23. JudgeLarryDawg

    JudgeLarryDawg War Daddy
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    Wimp Sanderson, the Alabama basketball coach in the 1980's was asked, "Coach, how many of your players graduate?"
    Sanderson, quickly answered, "All that want to."

    That's pretty much the answer to many of the problems with society today but Dems choose to give to these people so they will be forever dependent on the party.
     
  24. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    Since you don't know who to put your answers in a separate post I'll go one by one

    Tax cuts decrease revenue? You say trickle down doesn't work? How do you trickle up? You ever get a job from a poor person.

    Kennedy, Reagan, Bush not Trump increased revenues with tax cuts
    https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/income-tax-revenues-trump-tax-cuts-economic-growth/

    http://time.com/4511870/john-f-kennedy-and-ronald-reagan-tax-policy/

    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/6-lessons-from-jfk-on-tax-policy-2013-11-22

    The problem you have is in buying into Keynesian economics. Which thinks there's a limited amount of pie. Not how it works in a supply and demand economy,
     
  25. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    I didn't call you a moron, I said you were delusional. I've posted fact, you OTOH just come back with loony talking points about socialized medicine and bullshit about life expectancy ....You know its made up right? It factors the US's accidents and homicides not just health care. If you get a serious disease you want to be in America. Cancer survival rates are significantly higher here than the rest of the world. Socialized medicine doesn't work.

    Well skippy, you've answered your own question. When do you think it started? THE GREAT SOCIETY. I gave you that earlier. How's it worked out? Or are you just going to play ignorant? Take a lot at any socialist run Country, State, City, Town and I'll show you a population without hope or Initiative. How about Detroit? Baltimore , California? Argentina, Cuba.......And please don't try the lame ass Nordic Countries BS because they aren't socialist.....I know being a liberal you wouldn't know that because you've heard they were from Idiots like Crazy Bernie and AOCC , But they aren't. See Kid, your education has failed you.

    https://www.heritage.org/poverty-and-inequality/commentary/assessing-the-great-society

    https://www.foxnews.com/transcript/author-shelby-steele-on-race-relations-equality-in-america
     
  26. jbpayne32

    jbpayne32 Silent Majority
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    "If you look only at the nine months after the cuts took effect, you’ll see that revenue is ever so slightly down, year over year: From January through September 2017, revenues were $2.57 trillion. For the same period in 2018, they were $2.56 trillion. Which is to say, they’re down by $10 billion, in a direct comparison after the tax cuts started. Personal tax receipts are up on their own, but corporate tax receipts are down by about a third from a year ago.

    That overall drop looks worse when you consider inflation. A dollar today buys about 2 percent less than it did a year ago, according to the inflation index used by the Federal Reserve to set monetary policy." FACTS

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/17/business/trump-tax-cuts-revenue.html

    Trickle down does not work and the International Monetary Fund, agrees...FACTS
    https://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/sdn/2015/sdn1513.pdf

    Also, Keynesian Economics and the fixed-pie fallacy are not related...
     
  27. jbpayne32

    jbpayne32 Silent Majority
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    I specifically said MORTALITY RATES as I agree that Life Expectancy is too complicated, but here are some more FACTS for you. The US has the highest per capita spend on healthcare, but we in fact are not the lowest for MORTALITY RATES of cancer and other diseases. Switzerland (Govt paid for), Japan (70% govt paid for), Sweden (Govt funded) all lower despite spending much less and having government paid for care.

    https://www.healthsystemtracker.org...ies-u-s-relatively-low-mortality-rate-cancers

    Thanks for making my prior point for me with your article. Here's the quote: "Material poverty has declined, to be sure. Census Bureau data show that the average household classified as “poor” not only reports having enough food, but also many amenities, including air-conditioning, cable TV, Internet access and personal computers."

    Also, both of those articles are not FACTS, but are opinion pieces. Facts involve data and data shows poverty has declined since the Great Society.

    Why do you resort to ad hominem attacks? I never said anything about socialism and you bring it up to distract from the actual debate...typical
     
  28. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    Oh Dear God. You need to get way from these left wing sites. The mortality rates are biased by leaving out things that don't fit the agenda, like infant mortality for example, the overall mortality rate raises when you judge the USA as you do other Countries, they don't count stillbirths , premature births etc, so if they die other countries don't count them the US values life so its likely that those babies survive for a period of time because of efforts to keep them alive.

    The reason our HC is so expensive is two fold, Obamacare! and Government. How's medicaid worked out?

    No to your comments on our poor...Thank you, I don't ever want to hear about more handouts for the poor, our poor are better off than the rest of the worlds middle class as you pointed out. That does not change the FACT that the Great society has kept generation after generation downtrodden and without initiative . Again, please explain Argentina California, Detroit, Baltimore . Poverty has declined because of CAPITALISM. Without the Great Society we'd be so much better off, I don't know how anyone at this point after 50 years of this Bullshit can argue it worked (as a positive for those it claims to care about) it worked alright, it did exactly as LBJ claimed
     
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  29. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    Oh my God, pal the economy is growing at 3 - 4 % something that never happened under Obama. Do you think an expanding economy with more jobs and MORE TAXPAYERS reduces payments to your Daddy the Government? First, fck the Government they can do without IMO....But that's not what happens. Economics is my business and the guy writing the NYTs piece is as FOS as it gets

    https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/trump-tax-cuts-federal-revenues-deficits/

    https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/income-tax-revenues-trump-tax-cuts-economic-growth/

    Spending causes debt, not Taxcuts. Its NOT THE GOVERNMENTS MONEY. It belongs to those that earned it. You nor any other loony leftist have no claim to it. And back to Keynesian. Think about how stupid it is to believe taking the money from one person (taking out of the economy) and giving it to government to put back into the economy. Yeah that's Government efficiency for you .

    Simple chart

    More Taxpayers = More revenue
    Fewer Taxpayers= Less revenue

    Tax consumers = Drain on Society
     
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  30. jbpayne32

    jbpayne32 Silent Majority
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    Alright, let’s keep this simple. Explain the drop in the below chart beginning in 1964. What happened with Capitalism to cause a sudden drop in the poverty rate?[​IMG]
     
  31. washdog

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  32. washdog

    washdog Letterman
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    There is no doubt that the socialist plan is in place.
    Our press and education system has bought in and have no regard for facts or history. I hope people wake up and see what happening . Keep passing the word it's our only hope
     
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  33. washdog

    washdog Letterman
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    Amen
     
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  34. Rolodawg2011

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    Once again you suffer from not having the ability to understand what you're posting. Poverty rates before TGS programs was dropping dramaticly , after they've pretty much leveled off and stayed the same. Trillions in wealth transfer and what do we have?

    Again, you just ignore the facts, look at the places where ideas like yours (not original) have been implemented. Every single one is a disaster, and it has ruined lives, wealth and property . OTOH Capitalism has lifted more people out of poverty than any system the world has ever known. That's a FACT

    https://www.heritage.org/poverty-and-inequality/report/the-war-poverty-after-50-years
     
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  35. washdog

    washdog Letterman
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    If don't think that the Democrats support and encourage socialist policies
    you are not very smart . If you think that open borders and the Paris accord was a good idea for America there is not much hope for you. I will admit the republics in congress or not much better than the democrats and that's why we gone this far left.They hate Trump because he can sell the American dream which Government has been trying diminish for a long time.
    They paint Trump as a racist only to try to benefit them selves.Democrats can only stay in power if people want to be dependent on the Government and that is a fact
     
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  36. TCOBdawg

    TCOBdawg Pillar of the Community
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    "Crazy and Unstable" to the Left is if you don't vote their way.
     
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  37. Rolodawg2011

    Rolodawg2011 War Daddy
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    [​IMG]
     
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  38. deadduckdawg

    deadduckdawg Pillar of the Community
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    I’m pretty sure basketball bears some of the blame.
     

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