So we enter the war over Gaza Strip …

[LRA Dawg]

You guys are both level headed posters. I feel like I can ask you this and you not think I am being an ass. I promise. I am not trying to be.

When does anyone who votes or alignes themselves against Trump, realize that what keeps being said about him turns out to mostly be false. He pre dealings as a Democrat real estate agent aside. They were brutal and why he deserves a lot of mistrust imo.

That being said, how many times does what the media and other democrats say have to turn out to be false before anyone in your position gives him the benefit of the doubt. He is the most investigated person in our country’s history. By far.

Charlottesville. Bs. Russian collusion bs. Zelensky. Absolutely warranted. Jesus. All the bs trials. Etc. To now. Tariffs are going to clobber us. He has lost his mind. No. He knew exactly what he is doing. Elon is finding more crazy ass expenditures daily. This is just one percent of what our government budget is. If it is this bad, what are they going to find over the next year. Now the Gaza threat. First thing everyone does is think he is nuts. Just going off the deep end. I think we can safely say, he knows exactly how to try to push the right buttons. This is a threat to get what he wants. Which is all anyone in the Middle East responds too.

Next. Who is out in front of the Democrat party right now. That inspires your support. Schumer, Warren, aoc? Even democrat comedians are making fun of how bad they are. It is like a parade of crazy and moronic idiots. The left is allowing their versions of mtg to run their party. And to be the mouthpiece. I just don’t get it. You are both very intelligent people. Help me understand. No judgment. Is it just that you hate Trump that much?

@KidneyStoned I would have included you, I am clear on where you stand on Trump.

It's a short and easy answer from me. The biggest issues for me are actions regarding the questioning of the election results, which are totally unacceptable to me for a leader in a democracy. I don't think any of the talking points on the right come close to making the case he won in 2020. America is first only if it means he is first. I also can't stand the way he makes up outrageous lies at times simply for the sake of creating controversy. I agree with many of his policies, admire his enormous energy, and think it is funny how he plays with the media. I voted for Haley even though she was a write in on my ballot.

 

[Georgia Knight]

OK, so there is a lot where we disagree. No problem.

Using Trump and honest in the same sentence tells me you are really ignorant about him. I can understand wanting some of the changes he wants even if I don't agree with all of them. I have to laugh at you trying to say it's okay that a President lies or even exaggerates. We're not talking about campaigning where most politicians lie. We're talking about getting in front of the country and saying those things. That doesn't instill confidence to me. He started that at the end of his first term in case you have forgotten.

So sincere means that he really thinks DEI caused the crash and that it's appropriate to say that when the mourning has just begun. Fortunately, it appears someone else wrote his statement after the crash in Pennsylvania because it sure didn't sound like him.

So you make a claim about Brightline when you don't really have the facts. And try and justify it. No wonder you like Trump and I'm talking about him and not what he's going to do.

I said "more honest", it's a relative term. I was not referring to campaigns where "most politicians lie" (though that itself is kinda giving up the game), its that PRESIDENTS routinely lie. Their lies are just more polished.

The DEI example I think hits perfectly, I think Trump does believe that DEI played a role in the crash. I think DEI probably played a role in the crash. Whether or not it's "appropriate" to say is a value judgement, I understand those who were offended by it.

To be pissy about a minor point about Brightline though makes it difficult to take you seriously, but I will do my best to try since you deserve respect as a fellow Dawg. The topic at hand was about California's problems with its train line. I pointed out how efficiently Brightline was able to build in Florida. That is unquestionably true, even if the project is not yet profitable. I don't think anyone ever expects the California project to be profitable. So you're trying to move the goal post to distract from your own point.

 

[Georgia Knight]

It's a short and easy answer from me. The biggest issues for me are actions regarding the questioning of the election results, which are totally unacceptable to me for a leader in a democracy. I don't think any of the talking points on the right come close to making the case he won in 2020. America is first only if it means he is first. I also can't stand the way he makes up outrageous lies at times simply for the sake of creating controversy. I agree with many of his policies, admire his enormous energy, and think it is funny how he plays with the media. I voted for Haley even though she was a write in on my ballot.

Honest question, are you okay with how the 2020 election was handled? The extra legal rule changes, the coordinated censorship of relevant stories, the lack of security with ballot dropoffs, etc?

Because I can entirely sympathize with people being upset with how Trump handled that process, but to me the way that we conducted that election is totally unacceptable for any democracy - much less America's.

 

[KidneyStoned]

thoughts on Ukraine ?

Ukraine is a 233,000 square mile country, rich with oil and natural resources, that serves as a vital geographic buffer between Russia and our NATO allies in Europe. It is in our national interests to assist Ukraine in defending itself against Russia.

The Gaza Strip is 141 square miles - about the size of Detroit. Its controlled by terrorists, but many of its residents do not support the terrorist regime. It is in our national interests to assist any ally in fighting terrorism.

Threatening to take ownership (?) of the Gaza Strip by involving our military in a war that started in 1948 is reckless, stupid, and dangerous.

That’s what I think.

 

[jpzd33]

Ukraine is a 233,000 square mile country, rich with oil and natural resources, that serves as a vital geographic buffer between Russia and our NATO allies in Europe. It is in our national interests to assist Ukraine in defending itself against Russia.

The Gaza Strip is 141 square miles - about the size of Detroit. Its controlled by terrorists, but many of its residents do not support the terrorist regime. It is in our national interests to assist any ally in fighting terrorism.

Threatening to take ownership (?) of the Gaza Strip by involving our military in a war that started in 1948 is reckless, stupid, and dangerous.

That’s what I think.

So you do not think that the US has an obligation to defend US citizens and bring to justice terrorists who murder 3 dozen and kidnapped numerous other US citizens…

 

[zingerdawg]

It's a short and easy answer from me. The biggest issues for me are actions regarding the questioning of the election results, which are totally unacceptable to me for a leader in a democracy. I don't think any of the talking points on the right come close to making the case he won in 2020. America is first only if it means he is first. I also can't stand the way he makes up outrageous lies at times simply for the sake of creating controversy. I agree with many of his policies, admire his enormous energy, and think it is funny how he plays with the media. I voted for Haley even though she was a write in on my ballot.

All of that is valid. I wish he would have moved on from the 2020 election too. It is a soft spot. Still being used by the left every chance they get. Asking Vance and several of his cabinet nominees this same question. Puts them in a bad spot.

He lost the 2020 election. It was razor thin for a presidential election. It was an upset. I think the rules bring in a lot of questions. Which I can at least understand why he may question it. The left was on their way to doing the same if they lost, it was the Wild West. You look at the numbers between the two elections and it tells a story. That being said, it isn’t provable. So move on. The way he reacted to the defeat will always be a distraction to anything he accomplishes as president. He has to know this. One of the things that drives me nuts about him. He keeps plugging.

 

[dawgfood0612]

Low country, I get your point, I’m willing to see what happens, and hopefully, it’s all a bluff to negotiate. If not, I have no idea what America First means.

Zinger, sorry, this was a response to your post.

 

[zingerdawg]

Zinger, sorry, this was a response to your post.

Haha. I wondered about that. I thought that might be the case. I was trying to find low country’s post. Thought he may have asked you that first.

 

[KidneyStoned]

So you do not think that the US has an obligation to defend US citizens and bring to justice terrorists who murder 3 dozen and kidnapped numerous other US citizens…

I said it is in our national interests to assist our allies in fighting terrorism. I think that is particularly true when US citizens are victims of the terrorists at issue, even if we aren’t the target.

Becoming a party to a Holy War between Hamas and Israel is not an intelligent way for the US to fight Muslim terrorism.

I’m not really out on a limb in my thinking here.

 

[BDawg64]

So you do not think that the US has an obligation to defend US citizens and bring to justice terrorists who murder 3 dozen and kidnapped numerous other US citizens…

The situations in Ukraine and Gaza are completely different. Ukraine is still at war where there is a ceasefire (tenuous as it is) in Gaza. If Ukraine loses, Putin extends his influence and potentially pushes on. I am of the opinion that this scenario is bad for the US. If we move into Gaza and displace Palestinians using military force we have entered into a forever holy war that we have artfully dodged for almost a century.

But to your statement, yes we should absolutely defend US citizens and bring justice to terrorists. There are 2 US citizens in captivity in Gaza as far as I know. Israel has decapitated Hamas and Hezbollah and has effectively neutralized Gaza. The leaders of the terrorist organizations have been killed.

What Trump proposed to do now is to occupy and take over Gaza. He mentioned using troops if necessary (We have no troops in Ukraine). That will not be cheap. I guarantee that would cost more than Ukraine aid. This is not in keeping with America First. I know, hopefully, he is bluffing per usual. But this time he just put a big target on his back at a time when he decimated the leadership in the FBI and CIA. The jihadists may not get his jokes.

 

[cherrydawg]

Dims like giving billions to iran so they can sponsor more terror. The obuma brandon plan for iran. Also don't defend yourself Israel. If he gets us in a war there I will say how wrong he was. But so far, including term 1, he was/is far better at defending American interest and maintaining peace.

The crying is all they know how to do. Sit quietly while dims destroy the country but lash out whine and act like brats when someone is actually doing good things for America.

 

[Papapete11]

Rent free.

 

[halfchubb1294]

To switch over to the Ukraine debate, has anyone thought about the fact that if we completely try and destroy Russia, what the implications would be? They’d immediately have a massive alliance with China and the whole world would be ****ed. It always makes me laugh that media and left always want yes or no answers. It’s never that easy. It’s chess on steroids.

 

[celticdawg]

I said "more honest", it's a relative term. I was not referring to campaigns where "most politicians lie" (though that itself is kinda giving up the game), its that PRESIDENTS routinely lie. Their lies are just more polished.

The DEI example I think hits perfectly, I think Trump does believe that DEI played a role in the crash. I think DEI probably played a role in the crash. Whether or not it's "appropriate" to say is a value judgement, I understand those who were offended by it.

To be pissy about a minor point about Brightline though makes it difficult to take you seriously, but I will do my best to try since you deserve respect as a fellow Dawg. The topic at hand was about California's problems with its train line. I pointed out how efficiently Brightline was able to build in Florida. That is unquestionably true, even if the project is not yet profitable. I don't think anyone ever expects the California project to be profitable. So you're trying to move the goal post to distract from your own point.

No, the topic at hand was Trump making outrageous statements and I brought up the $2 plane rides which I said was connected to the California train situation. It was about Trump and not you at that point. But you brought in Florida which was not relevant to outrageous statements. And just like Trump you had to make up a claim that it was profitable which was irrelevant. No need to check facts before you open your mouth - that describes Trump very well over and over again. You moved the goal post.

I'm choosing my words carefully here. It was not appropriate for Trump to make ANY statement about the cause at that point in the first plane crash. As I mentioned there was no such statement in regard to the second crash and I would bet someone made it for him because he can't keep his mouth shut. But the timing was worse and that was disgusting in itself. Many Trump supporters here did not agree with making that statement at that time. It was not a value judgment unless you have no values. I have a hard time reading that you think DEI probably played a role. I'm not saying anything further; in fact I'm not saying anything to you again since that's the way you think.

 

[woofn]

Ukraine is a 233,000 square mile country, rich with oil and natural resources, that serves as a vital geographic buffer between Russia and our NATO allies in Europe. It is in our national interests to assist Ukraine in defending itself against Russia.

The Gaza Strip is 141 square miles - about the size of Detroit. Its controlled by terrorists, but many of its residents do not support the terrorist regime. It is in our national interests to assist any ally in fighting terrorism.

Threatening to take ownership (?) of the Gaza Strip by involving our military in a war that started in 1948 is reckless, stupid, and dangerous.

That’s what I think.

When you say many residents do not support the terrorists (Hamas you’re talking right)…what % do you believe do not support and or support? I’m thinking it’s a vert very low % that are against Hamas. Why would they not want to get out of that hell hole if given the chance? I have no idea I just go by what I see, but if they are so against Hamas it would seem they would get the hell out. Obviously no other nation over there want the residents or even the ones who do not support Hamas so there’s that.

 

[55dawg]

becoming a party to a war that has raged for over a thousand years - American boots on the ground.

Sound leadership. Great idea.

I thought America First meant we didn’t get involved in this kind of stuff.

You guys bitched for three years about all the money we were sending to Ukraine, I assume you will say the same about Gaza.

OK, so there is a lot where we disagree. No problem.

Using Trump and honest in the same sentence tells me you are really ignorant about him. I can understand wanting some of the changes he wants even if I don't agree with all of them. I have to laugh at you trying to say it's okay that a President lies or even exaggerates. We're not talking about campaigning where most politicians lie. We're talking about getting in front of the country and saying those things. That doesn't instill confidence to me. He started that at the end of his first term in case you have forgotten.

So sincere means that he really thinks DEI caused the crash and that it's appropriate to say that when the mourning has just begun. Fortunately, it appears someone else wrote his statement after the crash in Pennsylvania because it sure didn't sound like him.

So you make a claim about Brightline when you don't really have the facts. And try and justify it. No wonder you like Trump and I'm talking about him and not what he's going to do.

Geez. Not again. He did not say DEI caused the crash. He correctly stated DEI has degraded the FAA and govt in general. DEI has negatively impacted staffing and also resulted in some unqualified hires. This is not debatable. I’ve seen it in living color. He actually blamed it on the helicopter. Which was probably premature for a President to do.

 

[55dawg]

It's a short and easy answer from me. The biggest issues for me are actions regarding the questioning of the election results, which are totally unacceptable to me for a leader in a democracy. I don't think any of the talking points on the right come close to making the case he won in 2020. America is first only if it means he is first. I also can't stand the way he makes up outrageous lies at times simply for the sake of creating controversy. I agree with many of his policies, admire his enormous energy, and think it is funny how he plays with the media. I voted for Haley even though she was a write in on my ballot.

I sincerely don’t see how anyone can be comfortable with the 2020 election. Aside from how the way major of the large cities conducted business, the media manipulation alone likely had a huge impact. That second part is not disputable at this point. You can throw in some of the prosecutions as way off base and definitely impactful. It’s very easy to understand his anger.

 

[Georgia Knight]

No, the topic at hand was Trump making outrageous statements and I brought up the $2 plane rides which I said was connected to the California train situation. It was about Trump and not you at that point. But you brought in Florida which was not relevant to outrageous statements. And just like Trump you had to make up a claim that it was profitable which was irrelevant. No need to check facts before you open your mouth - that describes Trump very well over and over again. You moved the goal post.

I'm choosing my words carefully here. It was not appropriate for Trump to make ANY statement about the cause at that point in the first plane crash. As I mentioned there was no such statement in regard to the second crash and I would bet someone made it for him because he can't keep his mouth shut. But the timing was worse and that was disgusting in itself. Many Trump supporters here did not agree with making that statement at that time. It was not a value judgment unless you have no values. I have a hard time reading that you think DEI probably played a role. I'm not saying anything further; in fact I'm not saying anything to you again since that's the way you think.

"I'm not saying anything further; in fact I'm not saying anything to you again since that's the way you think."

This actually gets to the core of America's true political problem. How do you have a healthy political body with this sort of mentality (which is not unique to you, and is applicable to plenty of others on "the other side" of your worldview.)

It goes to the limits of persuasion and dialogue as meaningful tools to deal with disagreement, which itself is the underlying foundation for a large (in scale, not necessarily service) government.

 

[KidneyStoned]

When you say many residents do not support the terrorists (Hamas you’re talking right)…what % do you believe do not support and or support? I’m thinking it’s a vert very low % that are against Hamas. Why would they not want to get out of that hell hole if given the chance? I have no idea I just go by what I see, but if they are so against Hamas it would seem they would get the hell out. Obviously no other nation over there want the residents or even the ones who do not support Hamas so there’s that.

No clear answer that I know. The last election was in 2005. Hamas won @ 60% of the offices in that election.

As far as polls or other public info available today, there is ver little - because nobody that lives there is going to subject themselves to beheading by criticizing Hamas out loud.

 

[atlanta cock#]

No clear answer that I know. The last election was in 2005. Hamas won @ 60% of the offices in that election.

As far as polls or other public info available today, there is ver little - because nobody that lives there is going to subject themselves to beheading by criticizing Hamas out loud.

There's a reason Abbas won't call for elections in the West Bank. He would be defeated and Hamas would wipe out his party, literally and figuratively.

 

[celticdawg]

Geez. Not again. He did not say DEI caused the crash. He correctly stated DEI has degraded the FAA and govt in general. DEI has negatively impacted staffing and also resulted in some unqualified hires. This is not debatable. I’ve seen it in living color. He actually blamed it on the helicopter. Which was probably premature for a President to do.

Did you not read what I was responding to. The poster agreed Trump said it and agreed it was true. He also seemed to say it was appropriate when Trump said it, but agreed some might not agree with the timing.

If you continue to make false statements you might hear about it again.

 

[jpzd33]

The situations in Ukraine and Gaza are completely different. Ukraine is still at war where there is a ceasefire (tenuous as it is) in Gaza. If Ukraine loses, Putin extends his influence and potentially pushes on. I am of the opinion that this scenario is bad for the US. If we move into Gaza and displace Palestinians using military force we have entered into a forever holy war that we have artfully dodged for almost a century.

But to your statement, yes we should absolutely defend US citizens and bring justice to terrorists. There are 2 US citizens in captivity in Gaza as far as I know. Israel has decapitated Hamas and Hezbollah and has effectively neutralized Gaza. The leaders of the terrorist organizations have been killed.

What Trump proposed to do now is to occupy and take over Gaza. He mentioned using troops if necessary (We have no troops in Ukraine). That will not be cheap. I guarantee that would cost more than Ukraine aid. This is not in keeping with America First. I know, hopefully, he is bluffing per usual. But this time he just put a big target on his back at a time when he decimated the leadership in the FBI and CIA. The jihadists may not get his jokes.

I never mentioned Ukraine. And I 100% agree that a strong Russia/Putin is bad for the US. I also think that Islamic terrorists are bad for the US. Hamas, Hezbollah, Isis, Huthis, AQ etc etc, and the largest state supporter of terrorism Iran. They want nothing more than to destroy us and our way of life. Israel is “little satan” and the US is “big satan”. Islamic terrorist still poses the biggest threat to the US. Especially with the open borders we had the last 4 years and who knows who the hell is here. These are people who do not value life, only death and destruction and chaos. So yes, I think keeping our foot on the throat of Hamas and Hezbollah and Iran etc, even damaged as they are, is just as important if not more-so than preventing Russia from gaining strength