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Election in FL just got interesting; amendment to protect abortion and Marijuana are potentially on the ballot potentially in Nov.....

Diplomacy & influencing policy vs. what you described as effectively election interference and/or crossing the bounds of national sovereignty ("want Biden to do more to get rid of Bibi") is a heck of a leap.
Israelis rightfully feel very much like we do when other countries try to influence our elections. The democRAT attempts to hurt Bibi will more than likely make him stronger.
Biden more openly abuses the power of the office than anyone I can remember. He even openly disobeys SCOTUS. I think FDR got pretty flagrant tho I wasn't there to witness. But for sure Biden is off the chain and the aggressive attitude among democRATs you point out above is common.
 
Looks pretty clear to me. The AZ Supreme Court made a dumb decision. And the republican leaders in that State have called it out. Media so wants this to be a huge story and the reason trump will lose Arizona.

What it really is is "oh no that's not what we meant...how do we put this genie back in the bottle..."
 
What it really is is "oh no that's not what we meant...how do we put this genie back in the bottle..."
I disagree. Trump has now made a policy decision based on what most Republicans see as reasonable. You democRATs want to paint everyday Republicans with the same brush as the far, far right. It simply is not true; just as it is not accurate to think all democRATs are as batshit crazy as AOC, Talib etc.
 
How far is too far to be forced to drive before it affects the person's ability to get this procedure. Florida has always been key when it comes to abortion access in the south due to its proximity. With RDS and the GOPs extreme law this will and has been shown to negatively impact women.
Fired up about abortion
Amazing that’s all you think about
 
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I disagree. Trump has now made a policy decision based on what most Republicans see as reasonable. You democRATs want to paint everyday Republicans with the same brush as the far, far right. It simply is not true; just as it is not accurate to think all democRATs are as batshit crazy as AOC, Talib etc.
I'm pretty sure the intention was not to send AZ back to 1864...I agree with you there. But now they have 13 days before territorial law takes effect. "Unintended consequences" and all that...

And there were plenty of az republicans who supported going back to that law...Lake being one of them. Her backpedaling now is hysterical to watch.

You are speaking my language about painting with broad brushes and not my intent here. As a dem voter I'm actually ok with a 15 week ban. That's plenty of time to make a decision (an eternity in the pregnancy lifecycle...if you've spent any time around a pregnant woman you'd agree haha). Any decision after that needs special circumstances (health of child/mother being paramount). Make that the federal law and let's move on with it.
 
I'm pretty sure the intention was not to send AZ back to 1864...I agree with you there. But now they have 13 days before territorial law takes effect. "Unintended consequences" and all that...

And there were plenty of az republicans who supported going back to that law...Lake being one of them. Her backpedaling now is hysterical to watch.

You are speaking my language about painting with broad brushes and not my intent here. As a dem voter I'm actually ok with a 15 week ban. That's plenty of time to make a decision (an eternity in the pregnancy lifecycle...if you've spent any time around a pregnant woman you'd agree haha). Any decision after that needs special circumstances (health of child/mother being paramount). Make that the federal law and let's move on with it.
Ppl don't care about that. Trump is correct. The AZ Governor and Legislature will handle. They'll end up with something between 12-20 weeks.

Meanwhile in Georgia today:

 
Abortion decreased in states with bans and increased in states where there are no bans. But you have Republicans trying to reduce the numbers of states where there is no ban...case in point most recently AZ and FL. Florida will be especially impactful as it will be the last southern state outside of NC that has an extreme abortion ban. No access and travel become an issues and will reduce family planning options for women. You can try and spin the GOP as the "real" pro-choice party because you think States should make these choices for Americans but it's not going to work.
The truth is, abortion access can be much less restrictive after November because a more lenient plan would pass. A significant majority of my fellow Floridians favor that.
But democRATs are likely to fill the proposal with land mines to make sure enough people balk and vote NO. That is because they want to keep the issue alive and try to blame Republicans for the problem. They don't give two shits about abortion. They care about power.
 
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The truth is, abortion access can be much less restrictive after November because a more lenient plan would pass. A significant majority of my fellow Floridians favor that.
But democRATs are likely to fill the proposal with land mines to make sure enough people balk and vote NO. That is because they want to keep the issue alive and try to blame Republicans for the problem. They don't give two shits about abortion. They care about power.
I don't disagree at all there.

Change "abortion" to "border" and we have the same for republicans.

In reality, these are 2 issues that neither party seriously wants to solve because they lose fundraising off these issues.
 
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I'm pretty sure the intention was not to send AZ back to 1864...I agree with you there. But now they have 13 days before territorial law takes effect. "Unintended consequences" and all that...

And there were plenty of az republicans who supported going back to that law...Lake being one of them. Her backpedaling now is hysterical to watch.

You are speaking my language about painting with broad brushes and not my intent here. As a dem voter I'm actually ok with a 15 week ban. That's plenty of time to make a decision (an eternity in the pregnancy lifecycle...if you've spent any time around a pregnant woman you'd agree haha). Any decision after that needs special circumstances (health of child/mother being paramount). Make that the federal law and let's move on with it.
I agree. 15 weeks is a reasonable timeframe.
Living in FL, I haven't kept up with what will be on the ballot in AZ this year. Is there an abortion initiative being voted on?
 
US doesn't forcing them to buy our weaponry right? Also when you consider how Israeli military actions, using American military hardware will affect American foreign policy interst in the Middle East that some would call for more of an...America First strategy when dealing with Bibi and Israel 🤔
America first strategy. Like protecting American citizens who are held hostage by terrorists? Avenging American citizens who were murdered by terrorists on Oct 7?
 
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I agree. 15 weeks is a reasonable timeframe.
Living in FL, I haven't kept up with what will be on the ballot in AZ this year. Is there an abortion initiative being voted on?
I believe so but haven't seen the information.

6 weeks in GA is beyond ridiculous. You can barely get an ultrasound worth a darn at that point...
 
I don't disagree at all there.

Change "abortion" to "border" and we have the same for republicans.

In reality, these are 2 issues that neither party seriously wants to solve because they lose fundraising off these issues.
Well actually, the much ballyhooed border plan that democRATs floated unsuccessfully was exactly the same thing they will do in abortion initiatives. They sneak outrageous details into a seemingly straightforward plan to make Republicans reject it and then they claim the Republicans are the problem. DemocRAT leadership does not want a secure border. They want to get migrants the vote. It is already happening.
 
Well actually, the much ballyhooed border plan that democRATs floated unsuccessfully was exactly the same thing they will do in abortion initiatives. They sneak outrageous details into a seemingly straightforward plan to make Republicans reject it and then they claim the Republicans are the problem. DemocRAT leadership does not want a secure border. They want to get migrants the vote. It is already happening.
Watch what will be in the baltimore bridge bill
 
Well actually, the much ballyhooed border plan that democRATs floated unsuccessfully was exactly the same thing they will do in abortion initiatives. They sneak outrageous details into a seemingly straightforward plan to make Republicans reject it and then they claim the Republicans are the problem. DemocRAT leadership does not want a secure border. They want to get migrants the vote. It is already happening.
Yep. Proving my point that neither party wants either issue "solved" or they would've done so already.
 
America first strategy. Like protecting American citizens who are held hostage by terrorists? Avenging American citizens who were murdered by terrorists on Oct 7?
Bibi and his administration dropped the ball on October 7, turning their attention away from Gaza and Hamas to placate the hardliners in the Kneset with the expansions of illegal settlements in the West Bank. Bibi and Hamas are both villians in this conflict.
 
I believe so but haven't seen the information.

6 weeks in GA is beyond ridiculous. You can barely get an ultrasound worth a darn at that point...
Yeah, I don't think any of that 6 week bull will hold up longer term. If you look at it logically, the 6 week stuff is just a nod to the far right so the politicians can say, "we did our best" and keep them voting. It's just like democRAT politicians do for the crazy ass leftist fringe.
 
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Yep. Proving my point that neither party wants either issue "solved" or they would've done so already.
Well, the democRATs are the ones putting outrageous details in both plans. In the border plan, how is that repubs no wanting to solve the problem? They are not putting land mine in the proposals. If they are doing that in border proposals, tell me about it.
Because otherwise. I have to disagree that it is both parties not wanting to solve that problem.
 
Bibi and his administration dropped the ball on October 7, turning their attention away from Gaza and Hamas to placate the hardliners in the Kneset with the expansions of illegal settlements in the West Bank. Bibi and Hamas are both villians in this conflict.
I don't disagree that Bibi dropped the ball and should go. He has been PM on and off for nearly 30 years. But it is not up to America to decide he needs to go.

And as badly as Bibi dropped the ball, the terrorists are the only villains in this conflict. That is it. Not Bibi. Not the IDF. No Mossad. Not Shin Bet. The terrorists and only the terrorists are the evil villains
 
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I don't disagree that Bibi dropped the ball and should go. He has been PM on and off for nearly 30 years. But it is not up to America to decide he needs to go.

And as badly as Bibi dropped the ball, the terrorists are the only villains in this conflict. That is it. Not Bibi. Not the IDF. No Mossad. Not Shin Bet. The terrorists and only the terrorists are the evil villains
If the palestinians didn't want their asses handed to them, they should not have let hamas run amok. Palestinians wholeheartedly support hamas. "From the river to the sea" is practically their anthem.
Israel has no choice but to annihilate hamas. That is what they will do no matter how loudly Biden pretends he gives a damn. Seriously, gimme a break. Thinking Joe Biden really cares what happens to a bunch of palestinians is laughable. He cares about how he looks to the wild ass loons in his voting block ... absolutely nothing else.
 
Well, the democRATs are the ones putting outrageous details in both plans. In the border plan, how is that repubs no wanting to solve the problem? They are not putting land mine in the proposals. If they are doing that in border proposals, tell me about it.
Because otherwise. I have to disagree that it is both parties not wanting to solve that problem.

Both sides want 100% of their pie and don't want to compromise their position for fear of losing their jobs. It's why we need term limits honestly.

I'm convinced if we cut off their campaign contributions and locked them in a room, they would solve both the border and abortion in 3 days.
 
I don't disagree that Bibi dropped the ball and should go. He has been PM on and off for nearly 30 years. But it is not up to America to decide he needs to go.

And as badly as Bibi dropped the ball, the terrorists are the only villains in this conflict. That is it. Not Bibi. Not the IDF. No Mossad. Not Shin Bet. The terrorists and only the terrorists are the evil villains
I didn't say he was responsible was October 7 but he was 100% negligent in his actions purposefully ignoring Hamad and Gaza. I will say this, Bibi is 100% at fault for the death of the 2 State Solution with his illegal West Bank expansion
 
Both sides want 100% of their pie and don't want to compromise their position for fear of losing their jobs. It's why we need term limits honestly.

I'm convinced if we cut off their campaign contributions and locked them in a room, they would solve both the border and abortion in 3 days.
Term limits is a different issue although I agree we need them.

But you did not answer. Show me where repubs are putting land mines in the border issue. It's not both sides doing it. It is the democrats. A huge majority of Americans want is solved, practically all republicans voters do. Letting a huge tide of unvetted migrants wash into this country for their political agenda is criminal.
 
I didn't say he was responsible was October 7 but he was 100% negligent in his actions purposefully ignoring Hamad and Gaza. I will say this, Bibi is 100% at fault for the death of the 2 State Solution with his illegal West Bank expansion
You claim there is a viable, sensible 2 state solution and Bibi is the problem while the palestinians you support chant, "from the river to the sea". You live in a dream world.
 
Term limits is a different issue although I agree we need them.

But you did not answer. Show me where repubs are putting land mines in the border issue. It's not both sides doing it. It is the democrats. A huge majority of Americans want is solved, practically all republicans voters do. Letting a huge tide of unvetted migrants wash into this country for their political agenda is criminal.
The idea that the President of the United States is "powerless" to prevent illegal border crossings is laughable. He's the President of the United States. If he wants to act on the simple issue of literally enforcing who can and can't enter the Country, he can.

We are literally talking about forgiving hundreds of billiions of student debt without an act of congress. But we can't allocate resources to curb illegal immigration? Laughable.

Incidentally the Prez granted a rare interview to Univision. Forget mainstream lapdog media. Gotta effectively go to a TV channel that doesn't speak English to grant an interview. I guess he hinted in eloquent Spanish that he's trying to determine if he has the power to do something?
 
You claim there is a viable, sensible 2 state solution and Bibi is the problem while the palestinians you support chant, "from the river to the sea". You live in a dream world.
Yes because of the illegal settlements in the West Bank. After the death of Yitzhak Rabin Bibi and his hardliners went full speed with the settlements making the possibility of a 2 State Solution an impossibility.

Now let me ve clear I'm not some pro-Palestinian pro-Hamas leftist. I've told people the Palestinians are just as much to blame for their situation as Bibi. Their insistence on using violence at nearly every turn has caused them to lose good will with the majority of civilized societies.
 
The main point of the article is the desire to un-do this decision.

We will see. The quick response shows me
They understand the political implications and will work quickly to close the door on the “republicans are taking all your rights away” narrative. If they don’t then your argument holds water.

Shouldn’t democrats be happy that trimp
And others may have seen the light on this issue?
Let’s just say I’m skeptical that a group of people who believe that all abortion is murder, and that their effort to ban abortion is a literal calling from God, have suddenly decided that they can now reach a reasonable compromise for the purpose of political expediency.

Seems unlikely to the extreme. Let’s see what happens.
 
I would say that the universal condemnation you claim is not supported by what you linked. The AZ House Speaker and Senate head both said they are willing to listen to their constituents. That’s political lip service and far from condemnation.

This quote from the first article perfectly sums up my view on this supposed reversal.

“They are trying to play it both ways. They’re trying to have this illusion that they’re moderate to get votes, because they know that Arizonans do not want a total ban,” said Dr Gabrielle Goodrick, one of the providers who temporarily stopped performing abortions when Roe fell. “This is just ridiculous. Now they’re saying that they oppose it? Yeah, yeah – a little too late.”

It’s simply not in any way believable unless they work quickly to enact an updated law, which will be aggressively opposed by the far right arm of the party. The same is true in FL with its six week ban. They can’t simply memory hole the last five years now that they’ve decided the electoral impacts of their very clearly articulated positions are extremely unpalatable.
Getting ducks in a row……

 
I've got a lot of Jewish friends as well and they foooking loath Bibi...loath! They want Biden to do more to get rid of Bibi and that's

Yep. Proving my point that neither party wants either issue "solved" or they would've done so already.
Hard to believe that the killing of unborn babies would be an election issue. We are surely a depraved world.
 
I didn't say he was responsible was October 7 but he was 100% negligent in his actions purposefully ignoring Hamad and Gaza. I will say this, Bibi is 100% at fault for the death of the 2 State Solution with his illegal West Bank expansion
I agree he was negligent. Negligence does NOT equate to being a villain though.

And that is a dumb statement to make. He absolutely did not make it easier, but blaming him to be 100% responsible when the Palestinians turned down their own state on multiple occasions is just dumb. Take a look at all the actions from Arafat and the terrorist actions that happened under his leadership for over 30 years. And then what Hamas has picked up and done since. And then as recently as 08 Olmert offering Abbas a deal for their own sovereign nation and Abbas turning it down (after Arafat turned it down 8 years earlier). They have been turning down their own state going on 80 years almost now. And Netanyahu is 100% to blame? Even 50%? He has not helped, but really absurd and asinine statement.
 
Yes because of the illegal settlements in the West Bank. After the death of Yitzhak Rabin Bibi and his hardliners went full speed with the settlements making the possibility of a 2 State Solution an impossibility.

Now let me ve clear I'm not some pro-Palestinian pro-Hamas leftist. I've told people the Palestinians are just as much to blame for their situation as Bibi. Their insistence on using violence at nearly every turn has caused them to lose good will with the majority of civilized societies.
Their insistence on violence at nearly every turn is the very reason there is no 2 state solution. They would simply use the peace as an interim to ready for another attack against Israel. That has been their behavior for almost four thousand years. That's an established pattern if ever there was one.

Claiming there is no peace because the Jews took back the west bank is simply not supported by historical fact.
 
Their insistence on violence at nearly every turn is the very reason there is no 2 state solution. They would simply use the peace as an interim to ready for another attack against Israel. That has been their behavior for almost four thousand years. That's an established pattern if ever there was one.

Claiming there is no peace because the Jews took back the west bank is simply not supported by historical fact.
If Hamas put their weapons down and released hostages, there would be peace in the Middle East.
If Israel put their weapons down, there would be no more Jews in the Middle East.

I can't think of any simpler way to describe the situation, and why the equivalence the media tries to instill here is a joke.
 
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"Hey, on second thought, we have decided we are totally fine with murder, as long as it's limited to a reasonable time frame after conception."

Again, that seems like a very unlikely outcome.
Looks like they delayed the vote. All of this will be awesome for drama seeking tidbits that “will deliver Arizona to Biden”….for a few days. No way this 1860 law survives more than that long. When it matters…..it won’t matter. If I’m wrong you can give me shit.
 
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Looks like they delayed the vote. All of this will be awesome for drama seeking tidbits that “will deliver Arizona to Biden”….for a few days. No way this 1860 law survives more than that long. When it matters…..it won’t matter. If I’m wrong you can give me shit.
No shit needed. We are just on here entertaining ourselves, speculating about what is sure to be an interesting election season.

I do hope you are right and the GOP finds a way to reasonable compromise. I think it's important and overrides any political benefit draconian bans confer to the Dems.

BTW, here is the background on the gentleman who authored the 1864 bill. W. Claude Jones appears to have been quite a character.

 
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No shit needed. We are just on here entertaining ourselves, speculating about what is sure to be an interesting election season.

I do hope you are right and the GOP finds a way to reasonable compromise. I think it's important and overrides any political benefit draconian bans confer to the Dems.

BTW, here is the background on the gentleman who authored the 1864 bill. W. Claude Jones appears to have been quite a character.

Entertaining indeed. Social media has given the loudest / craziest voices more power than they should have. Would love to see a non politician who is very respected run for President. It would do a lot to tame things down. Someone like Jamie Dimon or Ken Griffin. Problem is that politics is such a shit show, there is a huge incentive for honest people to stay away.
 
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Entertaining indeed. Social media has given the loudest / craziest voices more power than they should have. Would love to see a non politician who is very respected run for President. It would do a lot to tame things down. Someone like Jamie Dimon or Ken Griffin. Problem is that politics is such a shit show, there is a huge incentive for honest people to stay away.
I'd take Dimon over Griffen and add Mark Cuban to the list. Both guys are smart pragmatists who could craft reasonable policies.
 
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