US family health insurance premiums

[wwforest]

In 2010 my health insurance was $10,000/year for a family of 4.
In 2018 when ACA was fully implemented my health insurance was $28,000/year for a family of 2.
These are facts. My wife and I are both self employed working professionals.

 

[shonuff253]

It's a shame GA GOP and Kemp refuse to expand Medicaid in the state

 

[55dawg]

In 2010 my health insurance was $10,000/year for a family of 4.
In 2018 when ACA was fully implemented my health insurance was $28,000/year for a family of 2.
These are facts. My wife and I are both self employed working professionals.

I do have one friend that loves it. He sleeps until lunch everyday. Cuts a few yards when he feels like it. Lives in a mobile home that’s falling down. He never had insurance until Obamacare. He swears by it.

 

[litedawg1968]

And unless I missed it somewhere in this thread, the shortage of physicians certainly doesn’t help.

I would be fine if they left things as they are Can’t imagine it getting cheaper, or how tough it would be to even see a doc.

Thinks it all would be a disaster…..BWTFDIK.

It took me 8 weeks to see an orthopedic doctor about my back earlier this year. If you get a sinus infection or whatever and try to get a quick appointment at your PCP , those no longer exist. You have to go to an urgent care.

 

[litedawg1968]

It's a shame GA GOP and Kemp refuse to expand Medicaid in the state

Why k because they know the Feds will **** that up here too?

 

[3 Pete]

and yet... most other industrialized socialized nations are able to do it.

FIFY

 

[3 Pete]

In 2010 my health insurance was $10,000/year for a family of 4.
In 2018 when ACA was fully implemented my health insurance was $28,000/year for a family of 2.
These are facts. My wife and I are both self employed working professionals.

Complaints from middle class America are music to democrat ears.

 

[nice marmot]

In 2010 my health insurance was $10,000/year for a family of 4.
In 2018 when ACA was fully implemented my health insurance was $28,000/year for a family of 2.
These are facts. My wife and I are both self employed working professionals.

are you in Georgia or a southern state?

 

[nice marmot]

In 2010 my health insurance was $10,000/year for a family of 4.
In 2018 when ACA was fully implemented my health insurance was $28,000/year for a family of 2.
These are facts. My wife and I are both self employed working professionals.

For reference: for my wife and myself in a blue state that fully implemented the ACA, we have a 2500$ deductible. We pay for the both of us $1305.80 per month / ~ 15.6 K ... for BCBS. Preventative care is covered, as is pretty much any office visit with a copay. I am not sure what my max out of pocket is (and that is where you could get screwed pre ACA also) but it's not bad at all. certainly not ruinous.

Before the ACA, I was paying something like ~$800 for a single person (I don't remember the exact, but it started going up precipitously each year beginning in about 2005... ) that was fine... BUT when you would reenroll every year because of self employment, you'd get riders for preexist, etc. and the ground was constantly shifting.

I am very happy now (and older, so for two people, I don't bat an eye at 1305.80 per month for metal tier insurance).

you can complain all you want about the ACA, but it all comes off as a sort of soft-eyed nostalgia, because it had to happen for a whole breadth of reasons, not the least of which is the deficit that y'all love to complain about sometimes. etc. etc. etc.

 

[nice marmot]

FIFY

verrrry clever, showing great insight.

 

[cherrydawg]

and yet... most other industrialized nations are able to do it.

exactly what we need government run healthcare. No thanks. Our government has turned into nothing but a bunch of screw ups and non sense thanks to dimocrats.

 

[cherrydawg]

access to healthcare in the US is nothing to cheer about.

I know many many people who do not have a primary care doctor (and mine just retired, so I guess I am among them!)

"In 2022, U.S. healthcare spending reached $4.5 trillion, which averages to $13,493 per person. By comparison, the average cost of healthcare per person in other wealthy countries is less than half as much."

socialism blah blah, but HALF?!

please move to those wonderful countries and take some more libs with you. You all deserve all the wonderfulness in other countries. I got to visit a couple of communist countries this year. Most of them want to come here. We could arrange a swap maybe. We will give 10 libs for every communist that wants to try capitalism.

 

[wwforest]

are you in Georgia or a southern state?

I am in GA. During the 90smy wife and I BOTH paid for FULL health insurance (that's two full policies) at our respective work places. My parents did the same thing. But those times are long gone with costs now.

 

[wwforest]

For reference: for my wife and myself in a blue state that fully implemented the ACA, we have a 2500$ deductible. We pay for the both of us $1305.80 per month / ~ 15.6 K ... for BCBS. Preventative care is covered, as is pretty much any office visit with a copay. I am not sure what my max out of pocket is (and that is where you could get screwed pre ACA also) but it's not bad at all. certainly not ruinous.

Before the ACA, I was paying something like ~$800 for a single person (I don't remember the exact, but it started going up precipitously each year beginning in about 2005... ) that was fine... BUT when you would reenroll every year because of self employment, you'd get riders for preexist, etc. and the ground was constantly shifting.

I am very happy now (and older, so for two people, I don't bat an eye at 1305.80 per month for metal tier insurance).

you can complain all you want about the ACA, but it all comes off as a sort of soft-eyed nostalgia, because it had to happen for a whole breadth of reasons, not the least of which is the deficit that y'all love to complain about sometimes. etc. etc. etc.

It did not appear as I was complaining. I just stated facts of life without commentary.

Full disclosure: I did complain to my Congressman about it. He said that was not possible. After looking it to the situation I got a "whoopsie" from him.

 

[stray]

It took me 8 weeks to see an orthopedic doctor about my back earlier this year. If you get a sinus infection or whatever and try to get a quick appointment at your PCP , those no longer exist. You have to go to an urgent care.

Even Urgent Care has become BS. Wife wasn’t feeling good a while back so we went to the urgent care. Upon arriving they asked if we had an appointment. Ugh no. Well we can see you in a couple days.
WTF, it’s called “URGENT CARE”.

 

[3 Pete]

Even Urgent Care has become BS. Wife wasn’t feeling good a while back so we went to the urgent care. Upon arriving they asked if we had an appointment. Ugh no. Well we can see you in a couple days.
WTF, it’s called “URGENT CARE”.

It’s PA care. Good luck seeing a doctor.

 

[shonuff253]

For all of America's exceptionalism we do healthcare the worst than any other country on the world. Why we have our healthcare tied to our employer is beyond insane. There should be a minimum amount of care covered by all insurances like annual checkups. Prescription drug cost are totally out of control. NHS caps the cost of all prescription drugs even those incredibly expensive cancer treatments. A single prescription is £9.

 

[stray]

For all of America's exceptionalism we do healthcare the worst than any other country on the world. Why we have our healthcare tied to our employer is beyond insane. There should be a minimum amount of care covered by all insurances like annual checkups. Prescription drug cost are totally out of control. NHS caps the cost of all prescription drugs even those incredibly expensive cancer treatments. A single prescription is £9.

Someone has to pay for that cancer drug research and it won't happen at that price. Companies invest billions on research for drugs that never come to anything. All of that goes away with price controls and we end up fighting cancer and Alzheimer's with Tylenol and Tums.
I understand your point and wish that could work but that isn't the real world.

America's exceptionalism is actually because of the free market that let's companies take financial risks to discover that next cure. Take away or limit the profit motive and they don't risk that investment and people do not invest in those companies.

 

[shonuff253]

Someone has to pay for that cancer drug research and it won't happen at that price. Companies invest billions on research for drugs that never come to anything. All of that goes away with price controls and we end up fighting cancer and Alzheimer's with Tylenol and Tums.
I understand your point and wish that could work but that isn't the real world.

America's exceptionalism is actually because of the free market that let's companies take financial risks to discover that next cure. Take away or limit the profit motive and they don't risk that investment and people do not invest in those companies.

I'm sorry but that's a BS answer. You're essentially saying Americans need to take it in the A$$ for the rest of the world to have great drugs because of R&D. What happened to America First?

 

[stray]

I'm sorry but that's a BS answer. You're essentially saying Americans need to take it in the A$$ for the rest of the world to have great drugs because of R&D. What happened to America First?

Maybe I can simplify it for you. These drugs WILL NOT exist in the future if there is not profit incentive for companies to develop them.
Americans don't have to take anything, in fact they won't have anything to take.

There may solutions to this problem but your original post ain't it. I think the idea of tying US prices to the prices they are charging everyone else may be a good course. This creates pressure on them to increase prices elsewhere and therefore our prices necessarily would come down since they no longer receive all of their profits off of US citizens.

let's not forget another huge driver of medical costs is legal and insurance which go hand in glove. Tort reform is necessary but too many layers in DC are never going to let that happen. This should be what we are all screaming until it happens.

 

[shonuff253]

Someone has to pay for that cancer drug research and it won't happen at that price. Companies invest billions on research for drugs that never come to anything. All of that goes away with price controls and we end up fighting cancer and Alzheimer's with Tylenol and Tums.
I understand your point and wish that could work but that isn't the real world.

America's exceptionalism is actually because of the free market that let's companies take financial risks to discover that next cure. Take away or limit the profit motive and they don't risk that investment and people do not invest in those companies.

Pretty much the only country that doesn't have price control for medication is the US. So again with the current system you're ok with Americans footing the bill for the rest of the world for medical R&D. That's the opposite of America first.

 

[stray]

Pretty much the only country that doesn't have price control for medication is the US. So again with the current system you're ok with Americans footing the bill for the rest of the world for medical R&D. That's the opposite of America first.

I apologize for attempting to insert logic and reason into the discourse.

Please carry on with your rant.

 

[shonuff253]

I apologize for attempting to insert logic and reason into the discourse.

Please carry on with your rant.

I'm not ranting just pointing out your logic that Americans should learn to live with high prescription drug costs.

 

[stray]

I'm not ranting just pointing out your logic that Americans should learn to live with high prescription drug costs.

First, off I said nothing of the kind. I simply explained that your overly simplistic view of medicine, if implemented, would remove the incentives that have given us the amazing advancements we have now. And very quickly those advancements would stagnate and medical care would be cheap but rudimentary.

I offered 2 possible changes that would lower medical prices in the US and you totally ignored those.

I'm curious, please define "high" in the context of you statement on price. If I had a pill that would cure your cancer completely, what would you pay?
Of course, with price controls it is much more likely you would not even have to answer than question because it would have never been developed.

 

[shonuff253]

First, off I said nothing of the kind. I simply explained that your overly simplistic view of medicine, if implemented, would remove the incentives that have given us the amazing advancements we have now. And very quickly those advancements would stagnate and medical care would be cheap but rudimentary.

I offered 2 possible changes that would lower medical prices in the US and you totally ignored those.

I'm curious, please define "high" in the context of you statement on price. If I had a pill that would cure your cancer completely, what would you pay?
Of course, with price controls it is much more likely you would not even have to answer than question because it would have never been developed.

"Healthcare costs are undoubtedly out of control. Yet the percentage of healthcare costs due to malpractice suits is modest and has been relatively stable over time.


Even if lawsuits were a major source of health cost inflation, tort law reform invites unintended consequences. Doctors may increase risky surgeries, for example, if they have less fear of being sued. Studies suggest that reforms have contributed to worse patient outcomes or increased use of certain procedures, implying higher costs."

What else do you have?

https://www.cato.org/blog/tort-reform-way-constrain-healthcare-costs