Liberal 101 vol 1 immigration

[Va Beach Dawg]

Can some Biden supporters explain to me the change in immigration policy. Trump policy had stopped the illegal immigration at the southern border and a lot of bad that comes with that. Why not keep that policy?

Kids will be sent to the US with thousands paid to drug cartels/gangs for each kid. For some the rough trip will be made worse by starvation, infection, abuse and rape. They will be placed in shelters while sponsors are found and vetted. Liberals will protest these shelters. If you let these kids come in undertrained, some will end up as slaves - literally.

Families will be seperated at the border because the law, for good reason, says kids cannot be housed with adults. Kids will be detained in shelters/cages

Of course drugs and gang members will come as well..

Please explain why the chaos needs to be restored

 

[BigDawgs2010]

This is perhaps the best analogy and I don't see how anyone could disagree. Take the drugs/cartel and family splitting out of the equation and mass immigration is still not a good idea. If you haven't seen this, please take the time to watch.

 

[SLC_Dawg]

I’m not worried, suggest you not either

 

[RawDawg18]

The problem with Trump's approach to illegal immigration is that it was inhumane.

https://www.oig.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/assets/2019-07/OIG-19-51-Jul19_.pdf

 

[BigDawgs2010]

The problem with Trump's approach to illegal immigration is that it was inhumane.

https://www.oig.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/assets/2019-07/OIG-19-51-Jul19_.pdf

Splitting kids from families makes no rational sense for sure. Send them all back if they are here illegally.

 

[RawDawg18]

This is perhaps the best analogy and I don't see how anyone could disagree. Take the drugs/cartel and family splitting out of the equation and mass immigration is still not a good idea. If you haven't seen this, please take the time to watch.

View embedded media

I have a couple issues with this gumball analogy, the first being that it assumes the goal of immigration is to end world poverty. I agree with him that if that's the goal, it's not going to put a dent in it. But I haven't really heard many people arguing that that's the goal of allowing immigrants in is to stomp out world hunger. I think the angle is more that when someone is fleeing poverty and violence, that at a minimum we shouldn't torture those people. I imagine that's something we would all agree on.

The second is that it just compares a domestic/regional problem on the scale of a world problem. What I mean by that is that you could just as easily "prove" that abortion isn't an issue worth discussing because the amount of abortions that occur each year in the US don't even add up to a single gumball relative to the world population. I think we'd all also agree that that's not the best scale to judge whether something should be discussed or not.

 

[Va Beach Dawg]

The problem with Trump's approach to illegal immigration is that it was inhumane.

https://www.oig.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/assets/2019-07/OIG-19-51-Jul19_.pdf

The reason for the over crowding is the mass influx which has been increasing since 2009. Trump was able to cut that flow and the over crowding has ended. Why reverse the policies that have ended the inhuman treatment you posted? I have first had experience with the border illegal immigration issues. The policy under Obama continued under trump. The separation of kids from adults is for their safety

 

[BigDawgs2010]

I have a couple issues with this gumball analogy, the first being that it assumes the goal of immigration is to end world poverty. I agree with him that if that's the goal, it's not going to put a dent in it. But I haven't really heard many people arguing that that's the goal of allowing immigrants in is to stomp out world hunger. I think the angle is more that when someone is fleeing poverty and violence, that at a minimum we shouldn't torture those people. I imagine that's something we would all agree on.

The second is that it just compares a domestic/regional problem on the scale of a world problem. What I mean by that is that you could just as easily "prove" that abortion isn't an issue worth discussing because the amount of abortions that occur each year in the US don't even add up to a single gumball relative to the world population. I think we'd all also agree that that's not the best scale to judge whether something should be discussed or not.

I can see those points but the main point for me is that we don't have the resources nor infrastructure to accept these these masses of people. Also, he makes a good point that the people coming legally are the ones that could really help reform their countries.

 

[DTwnDawg]

Texas judge extends suspension of Biden deportation moratorium plan

A federal judge in Texas extended the suspension of President Biden’s 100-day moratorium on deportation through Feb. 23.

www.foxnews.com

 

[phoenixdawg]

You are asking the wrong question, why not open up the floodgates for those from Europe who want to immigrate legally. Second question, why can’t we expect the masses from Central America to fix there own country.

 

[Deadlyputter]

Splitting kids from families makes no rational sense for sure. Send them all back if they are here illegally.

Explain to me how you can tell who's a family unit and who are human and sex traffickers.

 

[BigDawgs2010]

Explain to me how you can tell who's a family unit and who are human and sex traffickers.

Well after an interview by a child psychologist they could figure it out. I'm not saying not to split them in the short term to sort things out but getting kids lost isn't solving anything.

 

[Zonadog]

Well after an interview by a child psychologist they could figure it out. I'm not saying not to split them in the short term to sort things out but getting kids lost isn't solving anything.

"This person is your mother. Tell everyone this. If you fail, even once, we will kill your sister." DNA tests help, but take time. They do not help in the case of a marital relative or guardian. Limit border staff and it takes even longer.

If you don't have a deterrent, you wind up dealing with more and more children being smuggled across the border for you to deal with, and you will never catch them all.

 

[BigDawgs2010]

"This person is your mother. Tell everyone this. If you fail, even once, we will kill your sister." DNA tests help, but take time. They do not help in the case of a marital relative or guardian. Limit border staff and it takes even longer.

If you don't have a deterrent, you wind up dealing with more and more children being smuggled across the border for you to deal with, and you will never catch them all.

Yep

 

[RawDawg18]

I'm fine with sending them all back.

Do you all promise not to complain about rising costs of restaurants, groceries, and many any other daily expenditures if that happens?

Some on here were having a meltdown a couple weeks ago about the prospect of McDonald’s double cheeseburgers going from $1 to $1.10. I just wanna make sure you’ve really thought this through.

 

[Va Beach Dawg]

Do you all promise not to complain about rising costs of restaurants, groceries, and many any other daily expenditures if that happens?

Some on here were having a meltdown a couple weeks ago about the prospect of McDonald’s double cheeseburgers going from $1 to $1.10. I just wanna make sure you’ve really thought this through.

You don’t understand economics and a market system. The over abundant low skill workforce has kept downward pressure on low end wages. If we didn’t allow mass immigration, the wages would rise. Yes prices would go up but that inflation is healthy. Suddenly doubling low end wages will shock the system and the inflation will lead to a rescission. Add to that more low end workers and there will be a lot of people on unemployment. Just as Obama’s did, the fastest growing labor segment would be welfare recipients

 

[thinkinofmontreal]

Can some Biden supporters explain to me the change in immigration policy. Trump policy had stopped the illegal immigration at the southern border and a lot of bad that comes with that. Why not keep that policy?

Kids will be sent to the US with thousands paid to drug cartels/gangs for each kid. For some the rough trip will be made worse by starvation, infection, abuse and rape. They will be placed in shelters while sponsors are found and vetted. Liberals will protest these shelters. If you let these kids come in undertrained, some will end up as slaves - literally.

Families will be seperated at the border because the law, for good reason, says kids cannot be housed with adults. Kids will be detained in shelters/cages

Of course drugs and gang members will come as well..

Please explain why the chaos needs to be restored

Nothing dems do now makes sense. It’s all about race and demonizing trump supporters. And it’s not really about Trump supporters. It’s really about who they are. That is subtley spoken in vague abstract now, but will become more overt and aggressive in short order. If you protest the wealth distribution that’s coming through mass naturalization of immigrants and in aggressive benefits to lower income earners, you will be attacked as a Nazi and hateful racist. If dems stay in power many of the opposition will be jailed and their assets seized. Their agenda is not to make American equal for all Americans, but to mandate equality for those they want to enrich. It is coming and it Will destroy the country as Communism always does. What the Dems really want to do is evil and it will ultimately destroy the country.

 

[RawDawg18]

Nothing dems do now makes sense. It’s all about race and demonizing trump supporters. And it’s not really about Trump supporters. It’s really about who they are. That is subtley spoken in vague abstract now, but will become more overt and aggressive in short order. If you protest with the wealth distribution that’s coming through mass naturalization of immigrants and the lower income earners, you will be attacked as a Nazi and hateful racist. If dems stay in power many of the opposition will be jailed and their assets seized. It is coming. Will destroy the country as the evil Socialist / Communists do what they’ve always done. It’s revolving.

Hope you feel better tomorrow

 

[thinkinofmontreal]

Hope you feel better tomorrow

Ha. I feel fine. Don’t put my faith or trust in men Just what happens when idiots rule.

 

[phoenixdawg]

Do you all promise not to complain about rising costs of restaurants, groceries, and many any other daily expenditures if that happens?

Some on here were having a meltdown a couple weeks ago about the prospect of McDonald’s double cheeseburgers going from $1 to $1.10. I just wanna make sure you’ve really thought this through.

Why can Americans not work? Perhaps we should remove the safety net

 

[BigDawgs2010]

Do you all promise not to complain about rising costs of restaurants, groceries, and many any other daily expenditures if that happens?

Some on here were having a meltdown a couple weeks ago about the prospect of McDonald’s double cheeseburgers going from $1 to $1.10. I just wanna make sure you’ve really thought this through.

I think our country would survive a little higher Happy Meal cost when a large percentage of illegals are not even paying into the tax system. They are stressing our medicare system also. We can't continue to fund the lives of people not contributing to the system.

There are alot of people who think that it's making a difference, humanitarian wise, in the world to allow law breakers to enter our country illegally, when it's really only stressing out country to the max.

I'm actually all for bringing military into Mexico and erradicating the cartel so their country can begin to turn things around. That is a fix, not letting thousands cross the borders to our country every day.

 

[RawDawg18]

I think our country would survive a little higher Happy Meal cost when a large percentage of illegals are not even paying into the tax system. They are stressing our medicare system also. We can't continue to fund the lives of people not contributing to the system.

There are alot of people who think that it's making a difference, humanitarian wise, in the world to allow law breakers to enter our country illegally, when it's really only stressing out country to the max.

I'm actually all for bringing military into Mexico and erradicating the cartel so their country can begin to turn things around. That is a fix, not letting thousands cross the borders to our country every day.

Net illegal immigration into the US has been gradually falling off since the mid 2000s, and the total illegal immigrant population has remained flat / fallen slightly by most estimates.

Fixing the Visa lottery should be the higher priority.

 

[jbpayne32]

I think our country would survive a little higher Happy Meal cost when a large percentage of illegals are not even paying into the tax system. They are stressing our medicare system also. We can't continue to fund the lives of people not contributing to the system.

This is not true. A very large number of illegals pay taxes and are not eligible for any Federal programs. They pay sales taxes and Federal and state income taxes, whether through a fake SSN or otherwise. However, the income taxes and payroll taxes they pay do not give them SS benefits. They can also not get Medicare, (which is 65+, think you meant Medicaid) and only can get Medicaid in an emergency situations. They must pay for any and all other health services, even at public hospitals.

They are not eligible for federal student loans, food stamps, social security, Medicare, Medicaid, Supplemental Security Income, Children’s Health Insurance (some cases), Unemployment insurance or tax credits, which makes up 99% of welfare assistance.

Plus, as a whole illegal immigrants use services less than what they pay for fear of being reported to the authorities, so they are actually a net positive for this country. Good luck finding construction and farm labor in CA, AZ, TX and GA without immigrants. And CA grows 1/3 of the country’s vegetables and 2/3 of our fruits and nuts...that’s a big deal.

 

[BigDawgs2010]

This is not true. A very large number of illegals pay taxes and are not eligible for any Federal programs. They pay sales taxes and Federal and state income taxes, whether through a fake SSN or otherwise. However, the income taxes and payroll taxes they pay do not give them SS benefits. They can also not get Medicare, (which is 65+, think you meant Medicaid) and only can get Medicaid in an emergency situations. They must pay for any and all other health services, even at public hospitals.

They are not eligible for federal student loans, food stamps, social security, Medicare, Medicaid, Supplemental Security Income, Children’s Health Insurance (some cases), Unemployment insurance or tax credits, which makes up 99% of welfare assistance.

Plus, as a whole illegal immigrants use services less than what they pay for fear of being reported to the authorities, so they are actually a net positive for this country. Good luck finding construction and farm labor in CA, AZ, TX and GA without immigrants. And CA grows 1/3 of the country’s vegetables and 2/3 of our fruits and nuts...that’s a big deal.

They most certainly are getting more health care free than just emergencies. Many give false names and are undocumented. How are those bills going to get paid? Even if a very large percent are paying taxes, there is still a large percent not paying taxes.

THEY ARE ILLEGAL. What other country allows illegals to come in in herds just because they want to?

You would be able to find construction work when the market adjusts. The "minimum wage" for these jobs would increase by default. This should be how minimum wage is defined anyway. The real minimum wage should be zero. Let the supply and demand for employment dictate the wage of the job.

I have zero problems with immigrants coming legally, but just opening up the borders is not going to end very well. I just don't see how people could see the problems with climate change and not see the future problems with not preventing tons of illegal aliens.

So how many should we allow in? Do you not think there is a breaking point?

 

[BigDawgs2010]

Net illegal immigration into the US has been gradually falling off since the mid 2000s, and the total illegal immigrant population has remained flat / fallen slightly by most estimates.

Fixing the Visa lottery should be the higher priority.

Probably has something to do with conservative presidents being in office for a good chunk of that time frame.

 

[RawDawg18]

Probably has something to do with conservative presidents being in office for a good chunk of that time frame.

It peaked during W and dropped during Obama

 

[Maddog_83]

How about a trade system? Take people willing to work and contribute and ship out the useless leeches!